It was broad daylight about 12 noon.

I think it was this tree

A bush in Shepherd's Bush. All you need now is a shepherd.

When I visited Redcar recently I coincidentally parked next to a red car.

Yesterday, on the bus, I went past Cat Lane.

And there was a cat in it.

Pics or it didn't happen.

Butterfield wrote:

A bush in Shepherd's Bush. All you need now is a shepherd.

When I visited Redcar recently I coincidentally parked next to a red car.

I don't think I realised Redcar was a real place. I just thought it was some kind of Br*x*t 'red wall' comedy creation where fat yokels could be reliably found to talk b*ll*cks on the news. Producers and presenters and researchers saying 'Where was that place we were in this morning again? Who knows, all those places fade into one nightmare, lets just call it 'Redcar'.'

I wouldn't sit there at noon either. The atmosphere is one that could turn at any second. I've always felt that if I was going to be randomly and violently murdered, it would be in the W12 vicinity. It feels unsafe.

I used to wander down to the Bush to make purchases, when I was living in Notting Hill, and it was always a great relief when you made it back alive, up and over the roundabout to the safety of the Holland Park side.

It was always a feeling like a weight being lifted, or the sun coming out, or that feeling of enormous relief you get when you realise that something essential hasn't actually broken - you've just forgotten to plug it in.

Perhaps I subconsciously picked up on this, because I never parked at W12 again despite the short walking distance to my appointments in Hammersmith, opting instead to park at Richmond station 4½ miles away and walk from there.

Or it might have been because, when I came out of the W12 car park, I got caught in an apocalyptic traffic jam. It took me 2 hours to get to Roehampton Lane and freedom.

cosmictanya wrote:

Butterfield wrote:

A bush in Shepherd's Bush. All you need now is a shepherd.

When I visited Redcar recently I coincidentally parked next to a red car.

I don't think I realised Redcar was a real place. I just thought it was some kind of Br*x*t 'red wall' comedy creation where fat yokels could be reliably found to talk b*ll*cks on the news. Producers and presenters and researchers saying 'Where was that place we were in this morning again? Who knows, all those places fade into one nightmare, lets just call it 'Redcar'.'

I've been to Redcar. It was like going back to the 1970s.

SiberianPrincess’sMidriff wrote:

cosmictanya wrote:

Butterfield wrote:

A bush in Shepherd's Bush. All you need now is a shepherd.

When I visited Redcar recently I coincidentally parked next to a red car.

I don't think I realised Redcar was a real place. I just thought it was some kind of Br*x*t 'red wall' comedy creation where fat yokels could be reliably found to talk b*ll*cks on the news. Producers and presenters and researchers saying 'Where was that place we were in this morning again? Who knows, all those places fade into one nightmare, lets just call it 'Redcar'.'

I've been to Redcar. It was like going back to the 1970s.

I've just read up on it. Apparently it's not only a real town, but is an actual 'resort' just '7 miles from Middlesbrough'. And here it is...



A popular holiday destination with not one but two piers to be enjoyed...

Plans for a pier were drawn up in 1866, but lay dormant until prompted by the announcement of plans to build a pier at Coatham in 1871.[13][14] Coatham Pier was wrecked before it was completed when two sailing ships were driven through it in a storm. It had to be shortened because of the cost of repairs.

Redcar Pier, another pier as well as Coatham Pier, was built in the late 1870s. In October 1880 the brig Luna caused £1,000 worth of damage to this pier. In New Year's Eve 1885 SS Cochrane demolished the landing stage.[13] and in 1897 the schooner Amarant went through the pier. A year later, its head and bandstand burned down.[13]

In October 1898 the Coatham Pier was almost wrecked when the barque Birger struck it and the pier was thereafter allowed to disintegrate.

The Redcar steelworks does dominate the skyline in the distance, but there is a proper town centre, a seafront "promenade" with amusements, arcades and such, and huge flat sandy beaches. It reminded me of a small and not very busy Blackpool. The suburbs one drives through to get there seemed quite leafy and more pleasant than expected.

Butterfield wrote:

The Redcar steelworks does dominate the skyline in the distance, but there is a proper town centre, a seafront "promenade" with amusements, arcades and such, and huge flat sandy beaches. It reminded me of a small and not very busy Blackpool. The suburbs one drives through to get there seemed quite leafy and more pleasant than expected.

I have to admit that similarity to Blackpool in the better parts of town doesn't sell it as any more appealing than the looming steelworks and slag heaps. Not exactly Portofino. All in all, it sounds less attractive than a long weekend in Grozny. Some places should just accept that tourism is never going to be viable for them.

No, they're certainly no Portofino, but I'd guess it's a whole lot cheaper to lodge and dine in Redcar and Blackpool. They're an acquired taste, but then so are places like Portofino to some people. Not everyone wants posh and pretentious; something rather more ordinary, cheap and down to earth can be enjoyable.

Butterfield wrote:

No, they're certainly no Portofino, but I'd guess it's a whole lot cheaper to lodge and dine in Redcar and Blackpool. They're an acquired taste, but then so are places like Portofino to some people. Not everyone wants posh and pretentious; something rather more ordinary, cheap and down to earth can be enjoyable.

I genuinely doubt it. I don't know many places in the UK where you can find a plate of something decent, and a couple of glasses of wine on top, for under €10.

Well, fish and chips aren't as cheap as they once were. But there's always the pound bakery around the corner.

Butterfield wrote:

Well, fish and chips aren't as cheap as they once were. But there's always the pound bakery around the corner.

As I was adding above, I don't know many places in the UK where you could find a plate of something decent, with a couple of glasses of wine on top, for under €10 - in most of our nearest and dearest neighbours, that's the bare minimum standard. Standing near a bin with a steak bake in the drizzle doesn't really count.

'Posh' is very subjective, but even in its most undeniable form it's not synonymous with pretentious. It's the UK that's pretentious, overpriced, and riddled with petty class distinctions that rule what's 'posh' and why that should even matter for good or ill - not Italy. These are needless domestic barriers to good living - for all.

A belief in access for all to a high basic minimum standard is the opposite of posh pretension. It's democratic.

I'm happy with egg and chips and a milkshake at the local greasy spoon for two or three pounds, and nice service from Mavis the waitress. You can hear all the gossip from the elderly customers about their hospital visits!

Butterfield wrote:

I'm happy with egg and chips and a milkshake at the local greasy spoon for two or three pounds, and nice service from Mavis the waitress. You can hear all the gossip from the elderly customers about their hospital visits!

Yes, there's a time and place for everything. If you aren't in the mood to have egg and chips and sugared milk based drinks, while Mavis regales the regulars with tales of her latest bout of piles, that doesn't mean you're pretentious, imperious, cold and generally just some horrible 'posh' person.

Just as if you are in the mood for it, it doesn't de facto mean you're approachable, friendly, accepting of others, and joyfully 'common' (it just means you were in the mood for some grease). It's only really the British who make those self limiting assumptions. I prefer the spirit of liberty in life.

Always bear in mind, you do get absolute c***s who wouldn't give you the time of day in cheap British cafe's, just as you find lovely and accepting people in continental holiday spots. Not to mention, those who wear their 'salt of the earth' status proudly and loudly (we might even say 'pretentiously') are very often the least charming and most unenjoyable, mean spirited, and tightfisted people around.

Yes, but I try and see the good even in those.... rougher places. Sure, your Mediterranean holiday will be more generally aesthetically appealing but not everyone can afford that - or even want that. Some would rather just take a bucket and spade onto the beach at Blackpool and go to the greasy spoon for tea, and if that's what they like/all they can afford then they'll still have as nice a day as you will in whatever Italian resort you choose. Maybe pretentious was the wrong word, but not everyone wants extravagance, or luxury, or even wall to wall sunshine, even if they can afford it. That said, some things that are considered luxury today are as tacky as a kiss me quick hat.

Butterfield wrote:

Yes, but I try and see the good even in those.... rougher places. Sure, your Mediterranean holiday will be more generally aesthetically appealing but not everyone can afford that - or even want that. Some would rather just take a bucket and spade onto the beach at Blackpool and go to the greasy spoon for tea, and if that's what they like/all they can afford then they'll still have as nice a day as you will in whatever Italian resort you choose. Maybe pretentious was the wrong word, but not everyone wants extravagance, or luxury, or even wall to wall sunshine, even if they can afford it. That said, some things that are considered luxury today are as tacky as a kiss me quick hat.

That's absolutely true, but it was always the case. What's commonly considered luxurious has only ever had a coincidental relationship with desirability.

However, as I've always said 'buy cheap buy twice', and 'it's more expensive to be poor'. Those are both true statements.

Those who think they're saving pennies at the British seaside are spending extra pounds to do so. A short haul budget flight and a cheap hotel is almost always cheaper. If they happen to love the Irish Sea, that's fair enough, but if they think it's cheaper than the same time in Europe or North Africa or it'll take less time to get there, they're wrong on both counts.

I am myself partial to a bag of chips eaten at a bus stop. I just don't think doing so makes me better or worse than anyone else.